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	<title>Comments on: Azhdarchid Paleobiology, part I</title>
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	<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/</link>
	<description>New research on the most amazing of pterosaurs</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 15:10:19 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Bruce Mohn</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-38</link>
		<dc:creator>Bruce Mohn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 15:10:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-38</guid>
		<description>A Caveat on birds that stab;

I would say that the more correct verb would be spear.  Herons, anhingas and cormorants (perhaps others, but these are the ones I am familiar with)have a cervical vertebra that is usually kinked back towards the body.  When the bird sights prey, muscles snap that vertebra forward, propelling the head very rapidly towards the prey.  Some of these guys spear their prey, others grab.

While beak shape might be an indicator of behavior, I would think that an examination of the cervical vertebra would be more telling.  My reconstruction work on the skeletons of _Pterodactylus_ and _Rhamphorhynchus_ strongly suggests that at least these two species were incapable of such an action.

Do we have azdharchid cervical series that are sufficiently complete to say how their necks worked?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A Caveat on birds that stab;</p>
<p>I would say that the more correct verb would be spear.  Herons, anhingas and cormorants (perhaps others, but these are the ones I am familiar with)have a cervical vertebra that is usually kinked back towards the body.  When the bird sights prey, muscles snap that vertebra forward, propelling the head very rapidly towards the prey.  Some of these guys spear their prey, others grab.</p>
<p>While beak shape might be an indicator of behavior, I would think that an examination of the cervical vertebra would be more telling.  My reconstruction work on the skeletons of _Pterodactylus_ and _Rhamphorhynchus_ strongly suggests that at least these two species were incapable of such an action.</p>
<p>Do we have azdharchid cervical series that are sufficiently complete to say how their necks worked?</p>
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		<title>By: Terrestrial predators such as&#8230;oh &#171; Dave Hone&#8217;s Archosaur Musings</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-37</link>
		<dc:creator>Terrestrial predators such as&#8230;oh &#171; Dave Hone&#8217;s Archosaur Musings</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Mar 2009 07:38:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-37</guid>
		<description>[...] the point is very up to date including the recent work of Darren Naish and Mark Witton on terrestrial hunding in azdarchoids and getting it bang on (and let&#8217;s face it while this paper was well advertised, it&#8217;s [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the point is very up to date including the recent work of Darren Naish and Mark Witton on terrestrial hunding in azdarchoids and getting it bang on (and let&#8217;s face it while this paper was well advertised, it&#8217;s [...]</p>
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		<title>By: David Peters</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-36</link>
		<dc:creator>David Peters</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Mar 2009 02:23:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-36</guid>
		<description>Typo: Make that, Mark, not Mike. 

(blush) 

The last blog I read was from Mike Habib. My mistake.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Typo: Make that, Mark, not Mike. </p>
<p>(blush) </p>
<p>The last blog I read was from Mike Habib. My mistake.</p>
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		<title>By: David Peters</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-35</link>
		<dc:creator>David Peters</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Mar 2009 02:21:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-35</guid>
		<description>Mike,

You wrote (above): &quot;Birds that stab prey (herons and anhingas) have laterally compressed bills: in azhdarchids, the rostrum was sub-triangular in section while the lower jaw was dorsoventrally compressed. Based on analogy, this shape is suited for grabbing, not stabbing.&quot;

Was there a difference between some azhadarchid bill tips and others? Were some dorsoventrally compressed, and others quite sharp? 

And what taxon is considered the most primitive azhdarchid? Is Huanhepterus included among them?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike,</p>
<p>You wrote (above): &#8220;Birds that stab prey (herons and anhingas) have laterally compressed bills: in azhdarchids, the rostrum was sub-triangular in section while the lower jaw was dorsoventrally compressed. Based on analogy, this shape is suited for grabbing, not stabbing.&#8221;</p>
<p>Was there a difference between some azhadarchid bill tips and others? Were some dorsoventrally compressed, and others quite sharp? </p>
<p>And what taxon is considered the most primitive azhdarchid? Is Huanhepterus included among them?</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Peterson</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-34</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Peterson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Feb 2009 18:29:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-34</guid>
		<description>Graham,
I think the idea of animals killing their predators from the inside stems much more from &quot;dungeons and dragons&quot;  than observations of real animals.  Various birds, reptiles fish and amphibians all swallow live prey all the time wihout any ill effects.  The heron and eel story sounds very fanciful as eels have tiny needlelike teeth designed for seizing prey but not slicing it open.  Turkeys have such a strong gizzard that they have been fed handfuls of surgical scalpel blades and suffered no ill effects from them and eventually they corroded away.

Some birds like the roadrunner and shrike will beat a small snake or lizard to death before ingesting it, but this is due to the prey being quite large compared to their body.  Herons, cranes, and storks simply seize and swallow small vertebrates with impunity, to include sharp toothed snakes and rodents. There was an incident of a pelican in a London Park that simply seized and gupled down a struggling pigeon. I have little double Azhdarchids would feed on proportionately larger prey like juvenile dinosaurs with no ill effects, with no need to expend unneccesary energy trying to kill or stun them first.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Graham,<br />
I think the idea of animals killing their predators from the inside stems much more from &#8220;dungeons and dragons&#8221;  than observations of real animals.  Various birds, reptiles fish and amphibians all swallow live prey all the time wihout any ill effects.  The heron and eel story sounds very fanciful as eels have tiny needlelike teeth designed for seizing prey but not slicing it open.  Turkeys have such a strong gizzard that they have been fed handfuls of surgical scalpel blades and suffered no ill effects from them and eventually they corroded away.</p>
<p>Some birds like the roadrunner and shrike will beat a small snake or lizard to death before ingesting it, but this is due to the prey being quite large compared to their body.  Herons, cranes, and storks simply seize and swallow small vertebrates with impunity, to include sharp toothed snakes and rodents. There was an incident of a pelican in a London Park that simply seized and gupled down a struggling pigeon. I have little double Azhdarchids would feed on proportionately larger prey like juvenile dinosaurs with no ill effects, with no need to expend unneccesary energy trying to kill or stun them first.</p>
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		<title>By: Sam Shearon</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-33</link>
		<dc:creator>Sam Shearon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Feb 2009 18:30:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-33</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s BIGGER than a T-Rex...!

WOAH...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s BIGGER than a T-Rex&#8230;!</p>
<p>WOAH&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Graham King</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-32</link>
		<dc:creator>Graham King</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 20:47:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-32</guid>
		<description>As an aside... is it for certain what azhdarchids ate, and may plant items have been at least part of their diet - as with foxes and bears?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As an aside&#8230; is it for certain what azhdarchids ate, and may plant items have been at least part of their diet &#8211; as with foxes and bears?</p>
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		<title>By: Graham King</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-31</link>
		<dc:creator>Graham King</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 20:44:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-31</guid>
		<description>Re stabbing, and swallowing whole, I reckon a prudent approach would be to at least mortally wound, or stun,  anything that has teeth and claws before you swallow it (in case it fights back injuriously or even breaks out &#039;on the way down&#039;; I read a gory story when a kid, pure fiction or not I don&#039;t know, about an eel that escaped its heron predator by biting its way out once swallowed).
 
So it may have paid azhdarchids to give a hard disabling peck or so before picking up sizable prey, or to grab it then kill in the bill (maim or suffocate by biting, expiry through shock, or striking prey against surroundings).

What would be nice would be to find fossil prey within azhdarchid remains; or, fossil prey with healed azhdarchid-bill-commensurate wounds. (Well, I can dream can&#039;t I?)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re stabbing, and swallowing whole, I reckon a prudent approach would be to at least mortally wound, or stun,  anything that has teeth and claws before you swallow it (in case it fights back injuriously or even breaks out &#8216;on the way down&#8217;; I read a gory story when a kid, pure fiction or not I don&#8217;t know, about an eel that escaped its heron predator by biting its way out once swallowed).</p>
<p>So it may have paid azhdarchids to give a hard disabling peck or so before picking up sizable prey, or to grab it then kill in the bill (maim or suffocate by biting, expiry through shock, or striking prey against surroundings).</p>
<p>What would be nice would be to find fossil prey within azhdarchid remains; or, fossil prey with healed azhdarchid-bill-commensurate wounds. (Well, I can dream can&#8217;t I?)</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Habib</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-24</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Habib</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jul 2008 03:16:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-24</guid>
		<description>With regards to take off:

Despite the huge size, azhdarchids could have taken off from the ground, and quite rapidly, IF they used all four limbs to launch (that is, leaping from all fours, rather than just the hind limbs).  The evidence for a hind limb launch has actually never been particularly strong (it got rooted simply by tradition), while evidence is mounting rather rapidly for a quad launch.  Under a quad launch model, Quetzalcoatlus and Hatzegopteryx could take off from a standstill, from level ground.  No cliffs required.

Also of interest, azhdarchids have several osteological characteristics associated with expanded flapping capacity.  While the flapping would be limited to short bursts, it was probably quite powerful.  This makes azhdarchids classic &quot;flap-gliders&quot;: animals capable of short bursts of powered flight, that cover long distances primarily through soaring.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With regards to take off:</p>
<p>Despite the huge size, azhdarchids could have taken off from the ground, and quite rapidly, IF they used all four limbs to launch (that is, leaping from all fours, rather than just the hind limbs).  The evidence for a hind limb launch has actually never been particularly strong (it got rooted simply by tradition), while evidence is mounting rather rapidly for a quad launch.  Under a quad launch model, Quetzalcoatlus and Hatzegopteryx could take off from a standstill, from level ground.  No cliffs required.</p>
<p>Also of interest, azhdarchids have several osteological characteristics associated with expanded flapping capacity.  While the flapping would be limited to short bursts, it was probably quite powerful.  This makes azhdarchids classic &#8220;flap-gliders&#8221;: animals capable of short bursts of powered flight, that cover long distances primarily through soaring.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Palmer</title>
		<link>http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/2008/05/16/azhdarchid-paleobiology-part-i/#comment-22</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Palmer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jul 2008 13:05:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pterosaurs.wordpress.com/?p=11#comment-22</guid>
		<description>Fascinating work. If their habitat did not include sea-side cliffs,  I&#039;m puzzled about how these huge creatures managed to take flight. It&#039;s difficult to imagine they were strong flappers. What do you propose they did when targeted on the ground by a predator? They seem to be adapted for walking, but could they get a running start?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fascinating work. If their habitat did not include sea-side cliffs,  I&#8217;m puzzled about how these huge creatures managed to take flight. It&#8217;s difficult to imagine they were strong flappers. What do you propose they did when targeted on the ground by a predator? They seem to be adapted for walking, but could they get a running start?</p>
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